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FINAL KOMBAT – January 4, 2011 6:42 PM (edited 1/4/11 1:42 PM)
Balerion (1224 posts) Elite Powergamer
Rating: Not Rated
Ok, so, I need a bit of a hand coming up with how to structure things for the final battle in my Exalted game.

Basic setup:

The Party has one airship that will be fitted out with four Siege Weapon implements that can be fired, as well as people to man them, provided by the 7th Legion. There will also be a separate airship that is substantially better armed that the 7th legion is bringing in on their own.

The enemy will be swarming the city both from the East (where I expect the party to hang out) and the North (where the party is going to be really surprised when the enemy uses necromantic army engineering to build instant bridges across a huge chunk of the river).

The North isn't going to have anything spectacularly important, so I'm probably going to detail the 7th legion airship to hold off that attack mostly by itself with the aid of the city's usual defenders.

The East is going to have a 1,000 Corpse war frame - basically a forty foot tall soulsteel skeleton that uses zombies as its muscles and sinews. It'll plow through the walls and drop off the zombies inside the city defenses. I'm thinking that will be piloted by a particularly powerful War Ghost, but the sole remaining Abyssal (the Daybreak caste, Abyssal version of Twilight) will be tooling around in a suit of power armor, though I do debate between power armor and a flat out warstrider.

So all of that is fine, though if anyone has any preferences on armor vs. warstrider just let me know.

The big question is: what does the party do? Here's what I've got so far, but I'm happy to augment this if anyone has cool ideas.

1) The Night caste will be piloting their airship, I'm thinking I'll handle it a bit like the fly by combats they did last time, where he can take defensive maneuvers and such. I'll also let him use an action to control one of the guns, but at a -2 penalty, since it would be remotely managed. He'll also get a number of actions equal to his Sail rating to command people to do

2) Zenith #2 will be commanding the defenses on the wall, so I think there's a lot to be done there and I'm in no great worry.

3) The Dawn and Zenith #1, when tempted with a 40 foot tall zombie horde powered skeleton will likely be unable to resist punching it until it dies. So I think they'll be busy as well.

4) The Twilight is really the big question mark. My guess is he'll want to stay on the airship, since he just finished repairing it. So I think he can be sort of a mixture of ships mechanic dealing with immediate damage and combat team to repel boarding parties . . . which means I need some flying units to do that kind of damage.

What do you guys think?

I really think the three “!”s really captures the exuberance that Clair must have been feeling when he almost said it. -Cuzzo
Re: FINAL KOMBAT – January 4, 2011 7:15 PM (edited 1/4/11 2:15 PM)
Cuzzdog (1522 posts) Head of Gamer Corner R&D
Rating: Not Rated
Here's an idea off the top of my head for the Night Caste. Instead of just making him the pilot, make him the captain. Break down the ship into tasks it needs to do (pilot, attack, defend, aid ground side battle, etc...) and instead of just saying he's always steering with an option to attack at a penalty, let him choose what he wants to personally attend to. That one task will be done the best. Then use that sail roll to allow him to assign X number of mortals to different tasks. The more mortals given to any one task, the better that task is carried out. It's kind of like in Star Trek when they call for "all power to forward shields". This way he'll feel more like he's strategically managing the ship rather than just making a steering check each round.

Maybe the Twilight can do basically the same thing, but instead of commanding what the ship does, he's in charge of focusing on what gets repaired. There can even be a 1:1 correlation between what the Night Caste can do and what the Twilight can repair (enhance if it's already at 100%?). For instance, he can choose to keep the airbag sealed and inflated. If the airbag gets too deflated the Night Caste starts taking penalties to maneuverability. If the airbags are already full, he can focus on maintaining the perfect amount of air to increase the ship's speed. He can keep the guns repaired to keep them firing well, or focus on them to make them deal extra damage/faster rate, etc...

Re: FINAL KOMBAT – January 4, 2011 7:33 PM (edited 1/4/11 2:33 PM)
chaoscat (452 posts) Ambassador of Good Will
Rating: Not Rated
I (shudder) agree with Cuzzo. The airship wants to be a star trek battle, with the twilight as Engineer Scott. Especially cool would be to have the ship boarded and have the PCs have to choose between keeping it working and defending themselves. The twilight could make Craft(bullshit) rolls to route power to defense or offense for some bonus (maybe his successes on the craft roll in extra dice?), with the night calling for this or that. Ideally, he'd be below decks so wouldn't know exactly what was going on other than from the night's reports and random things exploding, but that's probably hard to manage in practice.

Syllabic (4:14 PM): tozzi are you like dowd's jiminy cricket
Re: FINAL KOMBAT – January 4, 2011 9:53 PM (edited 1/4/11 4:53 PM)
Balerion (1224 posts) Elite Powergamer
Rating: Not Rated
So, while the site was down I e-mailed this to Tozzi since I knew he was around:

It sounds like I need three maps:

1) Tactical map of overall battle for interactions between ship and ground battle

2) Scale map of wall where the giant is coming in so that the Zeniths and the Dawn can have the ground fight

3) Scale map of ship interior so that we can have "repel the invaders" style combat

I think I'll have the Abyssal in power armor so that he can fly up to the ship and be their primary antagonist. It helps that the Zenith has a set of wings which will allow him to move between the two fights.

I think the Twilight's mechanics will be:

In addition to normal actions he can take the following actions:

1) Int + Craft (1st Age Devices) to bolster a ship's systems - either Attack, Defense, or Speed - can be done from main engineering console

Doing this results in creating a pool of his successes that can be added to any of the relevant actions until such time as the Twilight's turn comes up again. If the Night is not commanding the ship then the Successes are drawn from on a first come, first serve basis to try to avoid or augment attacks. If the Night is commanding they may assign the successes at will to each attack or defense.

2) Dexterity + Craft roll to make repairs to the ship as they occur, potentially even rebuilding the hull - this action requires him to be in the vicinity of the damage (i.e. climbing on the outer hull to repair light structural damage)

3) Int + Lore roll to divest some of his essence to the ship in the event of a power failure, either of the main systems or the guns - can be done from main engineering console

Any actions taken will need to be declared at the start of his turn, cannot take more special actions than his Craft (1st Age) score and flurry penalties apply.

The crew is pretty small on this ship, so the strategic thing doesn't quite work, but we can try some updated mechanics similar to the Twilight:

The Night can personally attend to either the piloting of the ship or to the guns. Whichever he chooses not to attend to are handled by an NPC and are therefore left in the DM's hands for that action.

1) When he's piloting the ship he can roll Wits + Sail and use the successes to either augment speed or defense value. From here he can communicate with the engine room, allowing him to assign the successes generated by the Twilight on a case by case basis. He can flurry a Charisma + Sail roll to choose targets for one gun per success on this roll, otherwise targets are DM fiat for that action

2) When he's on a gun he can use his archery roll and charms to fire that gun, which should be more than enough of a bonus for that. Additionally he can roll Wits + Sail to coordinate an attack with the other gunners. He can flurry a Charisma + Sail roll to give the pilot of the ship directions, otherwise ship behavior is DM fiat for that action

In cases where choices are DM fiat the choices made will generally be solid, and damaging to the enemy, but not necessarily liable to result in a turn of events for the ground forces. If he wants to do something that is going to impact the ground battle he's going to need to be the one in command of that action.

How does that sound?

I really think the three “!”s really captures the exuberance that Clair must have been feeling when he almost said it. -Cuzzo
Re: FINAL KOMBAT – January 4, 2011 9:54 PM (edited 1/4/11 4:54 PM)
Balerion (1224 posts) Elite Powergamer
Rating: Not Rated
And he replied:

I like it. I think you've got some solid mechanics, with reasonable
but not overpowering effects. I think you should flesh out what the
ship can do to impact the ground battle, since that's likely to come
up quite a bit.

To which I responded:

Good point.

So, for the interaction:

I'm thinking that all this happens on the tactical map. Undead and human armies will be broken down into squares (probably coins, actually).

Two squares attacking the same square destroy that square.

Two squares attacking each other are a holding action.

Being elevated above the other square = + 1 square worth of power

Each unit can move one square per turn

Having a Dragon Blood in your square = +1 square of power

Having a solar or Abyssal (or lunar or sid, but there aren't any) in your square equal +2 squares of power.

Having exceptional troops adds +1

Having exceptional weapons adds +1

So a square of people with a Solar in it could kill one square and fight a holding pattern against another square.

"Ranged" units can attack up to two squares away. Non-Ranged must attack adjacent

Each army will have "hero" units - (not just exalts, but also nemissaries and powerful war ghosts, demons or golems). A hero unit being attacked by a square will just take that many levels of damage each round (e.g. a plain square does one level, one with a DB does two, one with a solar does 3). No more than two hero units per square. Hero units can be a square in and of themselves if they choose to. Stunting attacks or defense will add the rolled successes to their power for that engagement (attack and defense being basically the same thing). Heroes can direct their unit's movement for the turn.

As an alternate, one hero unit may attack another hero unit on a given turn. Doing so removes both hero units from their respective squares' power total for that action.

"War" ability and charms can be used to "coordinate" attacks. Given that tactical combat will only happen once per round anyway there's no bonus for normal coordination. Instead he adds to the power total a number equal to his successes on the roll, up to a max of the number of participating squares.

War can also be used to:
1) Direct the movement of one square per success on a war roll, within a range of Charisma + War square. Other squares moved by DM.

2) add movement to a square the hero is in

3) "Rally" squares - once units start "dying" the commander can make a Charisma + War roll to rally the survivors. Doing so restores a unit to combat, no more than one unit per two that have died. Difficulty of the roll is 3, successes beyond that are how many units are rallied.

From the Ship:

An NPC gunner will automatically kill one square of the enemy army each turn, generally doing so in a tactically relevant location. On splash damage weapons I roll a die, if it rolls high then it kills two squares worth of people. Either way hero units in the target area take two levels of damage.

If the Night takes the guns then he can target specific hero units with the weapon's abilities, combat resolved normally and that hero unit does not contribute to their square's power for that action.

I really think the three “!”s really captures the exuberance that Clair must have been feeling when he almost said it. -Cuzzo
Re: FINAL KOMBAT – January 5, 2011 2:31 PM (edited 1/5/11 9:31 AM)
Cuzzdog (1522 posts) Head of Gamer Corner R&D
Rating: Not Rated
You probably have this in your head, just not explicitly written down, but if you're going to write down these rules for your players, you should state that non-ranged units can't target units that are elevated above or below their square. I'm also guessing that "elevated above their square" means either flying or on a tall defensive structure.

Also, here's an idea for resolving a conflict that might be a little better:

Two forces of equal strength - loss of one unit from both sides. Owner of each side chooses which unit is lost
One force greater than the other with a difference of only 1 - loss of one unit from both sides, owner of the superior force chooses which units are lost on both sides
One force greater than the other with a difference of 2 or more - loss of one unit from the weaker side, owner of the superior force chooses which unit is lost

This way, you get more of an attrition of resources. It also would allow a player to bolster an important stack with reinforcements rather than just wipe it out all in one go.

You may want to have a rule that says Solar and Abyssal units can only be killed when they are in stack by themselves and are attacked by a force of 4 or more, or through normal combat against another Solar or Abyssal.

You'll also need to cover movement. Maybe just keep that simple and say each unit can move 3 squares per round?

Finally, the point of the battle. I understand this is an enemy army attacking a town right? So how about this: each square of defensive structure (aka, the outer wall) counts as a 3 strength non-attacking unit by itself. It can be chipped down each round. So if a attacking stack of 3 strength goes against an undefended section of wall, the wall would be reduced to 2 strength, then 1, then you have a breach.

Fill the inside of the defensive wall with civilian houses. Each civilian house counts as a non-attacking 1 strength unit. If X amount of houses are destroyed, the battle is considered lost.

Also, is there some difference you want to make between Dragonblood, exceptional units, and units with exceptional weapons? All three seem mechanically the same. Possibly you want to mark which units have exceptional weapons so if these groups are defeated, you can upgrade a basic unit by salvaging the weapons? If you go that route, maybe you can do the same for converting melee to ranged and vice versa. From what I see, you have this as your basic units:

Pennies - Basic Melee units. (1 strength)
Nickles - Basic Ranged units. (1 strength)
Dimes - A dragonblood w/melee weapon or exceptional melee units. (2 strength)
Quarters- A dragonblood w/ranged weapon or exceptional ranged units. (2 strength)
Special figures - Solars or Abyssals. (3 strength)
D6 - Flying unit. Stack coins on top to determine strength.
Three lines drawn on a square of the map - Defensive structure. Erase one line if this attacked. (grants +1 strength to a stack standing in this square)
Circle drawn on a square of the map - Civilian structure (0 strength)

You can keep track of which coin is from which army by saying coins that are heads up are the attacking army, and tails up are the defending army.
Coins from the same army can stack up in the same square. The sum of their strength is the stack's strength.

Re: FINAL KOMBAT – January 5, 2011 3:11 PM (edited 1/5/11 10:11 AM)
Balerion (1224 posts) Elite Powergamer
Rating: Not Rated
Well, I think I'm actually going to go ahead and buy green and red paper and cut it into squares to use to represent the different armies, it makes it more like a tactical display. I'll write "R" and "M" to distinguish between ranged and melee.

The "exceptional weapons" bit is for two reasons - primarily it's because the Twilight has gone to the difficulty of crafting a bunch of special weapons for some of their more loyal troops and I want them to benefit from this. As a secondary effect you have the fact that the Mass Combat rules in Exalted are supposed to give bonuses for magical weapons. Realistically I think if a given unit dies then there's not going to be any way for another whole unit to pick up their exceptional weapons, so for the purposes of this battle, once the weapon is gone, it's gone for good. As there aren't too many such units (probably only three or four) I'm ok with this.

Dragon Blooded I actually intend to represent with dice. I'll probably use d4s . . . we've run a few large scale combats and it helped to keep the special units power scale represented by die types, with the party as d20s, color roughly corresponding to caste or aspect. Same deal as with the exceptional weapons - there are only a few of them, and the party knows each of them, so I'm ok with dealing with them this way. I might give some of them special powers based on what their actual charms are (e.g. the absurdly badass wood guy can rally a unit at a 1:1 rate instead of 2:1, the Earth guy with the armor can reshape the terrain to repair parts of the wall).

Elevated terrain specifically just meant higher ground, so I did intend for other melee units to be able to attack it, just at a penalty. I kind of picture the air fight being totally separate, though I do like the idea of having flying units on the tactical map and able to be attacked by ranged units, so I'll go with your idea on the d6 stack thing.

In regards to resolving combat - I think we may be picturing units differently. I'm generally assuming that each square of the map is one "unit", there fore the allied army might have thirty units and the enemies might have 100 "units" on the map to begin the game. My idea was to resolve each unit's combat on a case by case basis, basically just running through the allied line given this scenario and seeing what happens on each one, with movement happening before resolution. I do like the idea of attrition, and I also like the idea of a "loss" condition. My problem with the attrition thing is that there aren't that many allied units, which is why I was thinking (to be nice to the players) I would have ties = no loss.

Ok, I've gotta go do some work now, but I'll see if you have any response thoughts there.

Thanks for your help with this, btw, I think it's going to shape up to be one hell of a combat.

I really think the three “!”s really captures the exuberance that Clair must have been feeling when he almost said it. -Cuzzo
Re: FINAL KOMBAT – January 5, 2011 4:24 PM (edited 1/5/11 11:38 AM)
Cuzzdog (1522 posts) Head of Gamer Corner R&D
Rating: Not Rated
Exceptional Weapons - I can understand this, and it makes sense. My point is, is there some mechanical difference you're going to try to keep track of that would differentiate a single unit with a bad ass weapon, a unit of specially trained troops, and a single dragonblooded unit. If they all essentially come down to the same thing, then you just start the fight by saying "Thanks to the Twilight crafting special weapons, your side is starting with an extra X amount of advanced units." Otherwise you may just be adding extra complications to something that will already take a long time to resolve.

Elevated terrain - I don't know the specific layout of your town, but if the fight is a siege, I'm figuring most of the defending units are going to be inside/on top of the defensive walls. Towns themselves typically don't have any significant elevation differences inside of them, and the immediate surrounding area is probably flat enough and won't be fought in enough that making this kind of elevated terrain mechanic would be too complex and not used enough. I'd keep it simple and just say flying units and units on a defensive structure (the walls, 40 ft zombie siege tower) count as elevated and need to be attacked with ranged units.

I think we are thinking of units differently, and if you don't mind me saying, I like my idea better Big Smile Here's the thing. I understand the defending units will be far fewer than the attacking army, but the defending army has the walls. In my rules above, the walls themselves count as +1 power to a unit if they're standing on it, plus it would have 3 HP itself. So just a single basic ranged defending unit on a wall would need at least an attacking force of 4 attacks to do any damage to the wall at all. So here's how it would play out:

1 defending ranged on a full tower wall square (5 power total, 3 from the wall, 1 from the basic archer unit, 1 from the height bonus)
4 basic melee attacking units (4 power total)

Round 1: Defenders win by 1 power and chooses to drop an enemy attacking unit and a segment of their wall
Round 2: Defenders win by 1 power and chooses to drop an enemy attacking unit and a segment of their wall
Round 3: Defenders win by 1 power and chooses to drop an enemy attacking unit and a segment of their wall - wall breach. Archer unit makes saving throw to jump to safety?

In any case, you can see how in the above, the attacking army needs to lose 3 units, and have 4 in total, just to get through the structure defended by a single defender. Also between each round, you get troop movement, so more defenders (or attackers) could join that stack to aid in the attack. If between round 1 and 2 a second defending archer moved into that square, you start getting the overwhelming victory and the defenders start picking off attacking units without losing any of the wall.

Also the air combat and choices the night/twilight have to make will be more interesting. Maybe the airship is far away from a section of the wall that's taking a pounding, so the night has to switch to captaining to go faster to prevent the wall from breaching, but maybe that spot also is loaded up will enemy archers so the twilight needs to focus on defense to keep from being shot down...

Re: FINAL KOMBAT – January 5, 2011 5:07 PM (edited 1/5/11 12:07 PM)
Balerion (1224 posts) Elite Powergamer
Rating: Not Rated
Oh, here's some better layout then -

The city is on a peninsula (well, probably a better term for this, but the setup is basically like Manhattan, but with the main land connection to the east instead of the north.

The city had a wall on the east side, but it was mostly there so they could have gates and tax people coming into or out of the city. In a preceding attack huge sections of the wall were undermined and then restructured by an Earth aspect Dragonblood using his armor's power. However, he couldn't really reshape them into perfect walls, it's basically an earthen bulwark. To complicate things, there have been periodic zombie attacks for months now, and the corpses have piled up outside of the wall, as a result there's basically a ramp up to the "wall". This is why I'm okay with melee units hitting other melee units on top of the wall.

That being said, the city itself is one of the largest in the world, and if the army actually breaks past the wall then there are plenty of high places for units to be in that are beyond melee range, rooftops and so forth.

Thanks for clearing up what you meant - I was under the impression that you were totaling up power for the entire side and comparing, which didn't work with my many small units idea. I like the idea of high ground adding to power, but it shouldn't add more than being an Exalted - hence my idea for the high ground advantage being a +1 since that's comparable with having a DB in your unit.

And I do very much intend to just say "you start with these four special units", rather than treating the weapons separately.

The 40' zombie thing is treated as a special unit (actually almost as a moving piece of terrain) rather than a fortification, it has stats and so forth and the players are going to have to tackle that one hand to hand (so to speak).

I'm also thinking that the enemy army won't be able to crack the wall without a special unit present, as I really don't see zombies being able to break down a wall.

I'm still enjoying chatting about this, but I think the idea is pretty much solid in my mind now as far as this fight goes. If you do still want to turn it into a full board game idea then we could try putting it in a separate thread?

I really think the three “!”s really captures the exuberance that Clair must have been feeling when he almost said it. -Cuzzo
Re: FINAL KOMBAT – January 5, 2011 7:10 PM (edited 1/5/11 2:10 PM)
Cuzzdog (1522 posts) Head of Gamer Corner R&D
Rating: Not Rated
Ok, glad you got what's going on down. I think I'm good on the discussion. I head that there were walls and was trying to come up with some cool mechanics to give the defenders bonuses for that, but I see they're already essentially breached and the height difference is really the only way to give a bonus to the defenders. I hope that battle turns out well for you. Sounds like it'll be a really interesting experiment at the very least. Before we see about turning it into a full board game, let's see how the dry run goes first Wink

RESULTS – January 6, 2011 5:55 PM (edited 1/6/11 12:55 PM)
Balerion (1224 posts) Elite Powergamer
Rating: Not Rated
So, I ran the last fight yesterday evening and I think it worked pretty darn well. The thing that I think made it fall flat was very much my fault as DM, rather than the fault of the system we came up with.

After setting up the map we jumped right into the battle. The Night, Twilight and Zenith were on the ship, the Dawn and the other Zenith were on the city "wall".

We didn't roll initiative, just did each turn in a sequence - shipboard actions first, then ground actions. Generally letting the good guys go first, though when the Abyssal antagonist showed up I let him go first.

The Night ended up using the Zenith to give shipboard commands - the Zenith's sail was okay and his Charisma was much better. Kind of messed with my plans to force them to choose, but I figured if that's how they wanted to use the Zenith then that's okay.

Combat was pretty straightforward, the giant golem got up and stormed the wall, flattening four units in one turn as well as that section of the wall. The airship was devastatingly effective.

Eventually the Abyssal flew up to the airship and attacked them individually. He was kicking some pretty severe ass, but that was when I made my mistake - I brought his ghost along. There's a spell that let him rip out his soul and make a super powered hungry ghost out of it . . . but when the ghost dies he's stunned for an hour. I forgot about that bit, and they killed the ghost.

I probably should have glossed over that, let him be stunned for a round and lose a few willpower, but I always feel bad when I do that since it seems to cheapen any sense of success they have in combat if I just ad lib everything.

Anwyay, shortly after that (they locked him up in the magic handcuffs so he couldn't regain essence) they also took down the giant golem - the dawn did a pretty awesome stunt where she ran up his arm and climbed up the body to the head, with zombies grabbing at her all the way.

Once the Abyssal and the Golem were down I declared the fight over - there were still some powerful units, but nothing they couldn't mop up, particularly with the airship.

Next session will be a denoument, and we'll see what they do with their prisoner and so forth, but the game is pretty much done.

I think the problem with this method is that it took some of them the entire plot arc to get used to the regular combat system and then I changed it on them. It also feels like the final fight should have been a personal one - in a lot of ways the fight where they caught and then killed the Abyssal woman last session was a much better last boss fight than this giant military engagement was. It's also very hard to fade out of a battle scene with creatures still on the map in a tabletop RPG, works much better in the movies Smile

I really think the three “!”s really captures the exuberance that Clair must have been feeling when he almost said it. -Cuzzo
Re: RESULTS – January 6, 2011 6:42 PM (edited 1/6/11 1:42 PM)
Cuzzdog (1522 posts) Head of Gamer Corner R&D
Rating: Not Rated
Sounds like it went really well then. I think if I was in your spot, the call to either keep the Abysal stunned for the correct period of time of flubbing it to just be a temporary decrease in power would have been based more on how close I felt the fight was going at that point or not. They still would have felt rewarded with the temporary stun/will drain as long as they weren't familiar with the particulars of that spell.

And don't feel too bad about the last climatic battle having different mechanics. I would say it probably worked out better that the second to last boss was a test of their mastery of the core rule set, but the final battle had some of that and then a whole new wrinkle they had to deal with on the fly. If you did have a more personal battle that just stuck to the rules like you're saying, it would have felt very much like you were just repeating that other fight over again with slight variations. This was something a little more grander.

It may have been interesting to see how long it took the players to mop up the chaff though. Even though at that point it was clear that they won, how they closed out the fight may have still effected the ending. But, what are you going to do? There's only so many hours in a day, and I'm sure just getting to that point took forever.

Re: RESULTS – January 6, 2011 7:15 PM (edited 1/6/11 2:15 PM)
chaoscat (452 posts) Ambassador of Good Will
Rating: Not Rated
Yeah, I'm currently pondering how to set up personal fights with large military engagements as a backdrop. I really want to capture the movie feel of the two champions dueling on horseback while the battle rages around them.

Also, in the near future (presuming my game ever gets going), I'll be trying to set up a massive fight that the PCs are utterly unprepared for and will have to flee (they're going to be reinforcing the garrison at Thorns shortly before Mask of Winters attacks, in a flashback scene). I haven't really figured out how to do that either.

Syllabic (4:14 PM): tozzi are you like dowd's jiminy cricket
Re: RESULTS – January 6, 2011 7:19 PM (edited 1/6/11 2:19 PM)
Cuzzdog (1522 posts) Head of Gamer Corner R&D
Rating: Not Rated
chaoscat wrote...
Yeah, I'm currently pondering how to set up personal fights with large military engagements as a backdrop. I really want to capture the movie feel of the two champions dueling on horseback while the battle rages around them.

I suggest starting a thread about it. It seems to work Big Smile

chaoscat wrote...

Also, in the near future (presuming my game ever gets going), I'll be trying to set up a massive fight that the PCs are utterly unprepared for and will have to flee (they're going to be reinforcing the garrison at Thorns shortly before Mask of Winters attacks, in a flashback scene). I haven't really figured out how to do that either.

This might be a good place to start

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